And I said before that children learn that he’s a guy who’s black because of the soot but that’s what children of my generation didn’t learn so I am reflecting on my own experiences here.

No I am not saying they’re wrong I am just saying just because some black people think it’s wrong doesn’t mean all black people think it’s wrong.

You could let polls loose on that and they’ll show that a large percentage of black people don’t really mind. But I think it’s good that there’s discussion about it because of course I do understand it that some people could take it as an offensive tradition, so it’s also up to white people to explain that even as racist as it may originally seem they do not intend it this way so both cultures can come to a conclusion and an understanding. (I’ve said somewhere that the soot thing is the political correct explanation that is used these days on kids, instead of the other explanations.. well other I never ever thought about the skin colour atall)

And I don’t know what Piet that was.. because I can genuinely say: I’ve never heard a Zwarte Piet speak with an exaggerated Surinamese accent.

I think that the complaining about “political correctness” comes up whenever people want an excuse to not change their behavior.  I can’t count how many times I’ve heard people in the US complain about having to be “PC” whenever something that they said is correctly pointed out to be sexist, racist, antisemitic, homophobic, etc.  They just want an excuse to not change. They want to act like everyone else is just so overly sensitive, rather than stopping to consider how their words and actions impact others’ feelings.  They want to think that it’s everyone else with the problem, rather than themselves.

For countries that are not used to addressing race issues so openly, I can see how  discussions like this would be a bit of a shock.  But that doesn’t mean that it’s bad to discuss the impacts of your words.  Before the women’s movement and the civil rights movement, people did talk about gender and race relations a lot less. You could tell a sexist or racist joke and most people would laugh.  But, that doesn’t mean that things were better then. 

I hope that people from foreign countries don’t look at the US’s willingness to discuss issues of race, gender, etc. as an eagerness to point the finger and call someone racist, sexist, etc.  It’s less about labeling people as “ists” and more about finding a set behaviors and a common language that can make everyone in the country feel accepted and comfortable.  It’s about recognizing certain cultural elements that were inherited from a less tolerant time and trying to change them into something better.

Well death threats, offenses etc. are kind of bad too. That’s what she’s suffering now. Of course it can’t really compare to other situations around the world, but I made no reference to that so I don’t understand the relevance of my use of a stylistic device in this case to say that she’s not quite in a pleasant situation.

Wait a minute, what are you actually saying? That I live in a country which refuses to discuss issues just because we’re less into being political correct? I don’t see what one thing has to do with the other.. being political correct could also have to do with putting a veil on something instead of addressing the issue directly.

I guess the main difference is that elves do not, in fact, exist.  There’s no real, actual history of enslavement of elves. It’s entirely made up and has no basis in fact.

The same cannot be said for ZP.  I’m sure that kids don’t look at him and think of slaves… because they’re kids.  Adults with a better sense of history and of the suffering that was inflicted on so many people should maybe be a bit more understanding.  There’s nothing wrong with making changes. There’s nothing wrong with saying “I liked this a lot, but now that I know more about it, I feel differently. Now that I know that it could cause others pain, I think it should be changed.”  There’s no reason to cling to traditions with hurtful pasts when new traditions can be made.

well all i can say is that she’s in a hell of her own making. I guess she’ll do better research the next time she writes an article about something in which she knows nothing. Or maybe she won’t try so hard to sound ‘down’ and cool in print. Oh here’s another one, maybe in describing the subject of an article she’ll refrain from calling someone a word/phrase in print that she wouldn’t say to the subject’s face.

I was talking about using the term “politically correct” to mean “overly sensitive”.  And I was talking mostly about people in the US.    I was just mentioning that I understand there might be some differences in perception among people who aren’t used to discussing things so openly.

slavery card?  did monopoly put out a “Middle Passage’ edition of their ubiquitous game that i don’t know about  :-p

Oh, im sure that she knows people in the industry that sympathize with her plight, blame the pickle she’s in on politically correctness, and will give her leads to other employment opportunities in the industry. and from what i’ve read unemployment benifits are better in the netherlands http://www.oecd.org/dataoecd/10/24/29736028.PDF than they are in the states where im at so she’ll be fine.

By far the best and most reflective poster here. Thanks, “Me”!

What a drama here…

Who would want an editor who has been responsible for the end of a magazine, which will obviously happen. I mean apparently it existed for 8 years already but I never heard of it until today.

You saying we don’t have such beautiful women in Jamaica is completely untrue. Jamacia is filled with beautiful excotuc women. I’m personally not Jamacian but my father is. Whenever I go there I see women with vibrant glowing skin. The same with Trinidad. My mom is from there , the women are so beautiful. I think all the Caribbean countries have beautiful men andnwomen. Do not look down upon jamacian people , its people like you that give them low self-esteem and the drive to bleach there beautiful dark skin

Glad   Jamaicans  are  responding. Because  in  case  you  dont  know it  a  lot  of  people  are  offended  that  Rihanna  was
called  a  Jamaican….So,  I  am  glad  you are  speaking  up.
Go  back  and  read  the  article  and  the  comments  here,
and  continue  to  respond

If said editor were deemed unfairly maligned by her former employers and she appeared sympathetic then I’m sure she’d have the support she’d need to get a new job. Now she can write a book on her experience, travel the states on a lecture tour and collect speaking fees until her faux pas is forgotten.

You don’t get it. How white dutch kids feel about Zwarte Piet is irrelevant. They are not the ones being depicted here. You should concern yourself with how blacks feel  about that depiction. It’s not your face that’s being painted on others, it’s theirs. 

You inability to see or even understand how they feel about it says it all. It doesn’t even matter if your intent isn’t racist. If you are told that your actions are offensive to a group of people, WHY would you want to persist in doing that? WHY would you dismiss their concern?

That’s the very essence of racism.  That’s the very reason why there is such an uproar towards this bullshit apology.

Are you serious? If I were Rihanna, I’d tell them to F**ck off again with that ridiculous offer. They insult her and now expect her to help them sell more copies of their rag?!?!

This is the most racist word I have ever heard outside of a movie dealing with racism. This is an extremely offensive word and it should NEVER EVER be used by anyone especially not by a white person. This is absolutely insane and I am very glad that Rihanna responded the way she did and that the editor quit. This is absolutely horrible and I would hope that nothing like this ever ever happens again.

Neger is as offensive as Nigger. Only the white Dutch people think that it is not offensive. I rather be called black or zwart

Let’s now beat around the bush. It was NOT an accident and was purely Intentional.  I lived in Holland and unfortunately 3 percent of the people there think like this. Sad that the rest of the GOOD people there are now unwillingly branded as Racist. The Dutch are great people and proud but have a problem with other Nationalities migrating to their country.  The first person who should have been fired or had resigned is the idiot writer.  As the supervisor, she should had controlled her writers appropriately.

Dutch people unfortunately think that of they don’t mean to offend you (and I truly believe the editor did not mean to offend), then you should not be offended. And if you are, then that is your problem. This is very annoying Dutch trait and thankfully they are not all like that. BUT it is the way things generally go. So if black people want to vent that they are offended  by say the cake called negerzoen, meaning nigger kiss, or the Dutch tradition of painting your face black and wear a curly hair wig to be a Black Peter (Dutch Santa’s helper), then the Dutch’ response is just that: We don’t mean to offend, if you are offended, then you are just too sensitive, and that is your problem. 
It is time for the Dutch to understand, that if someone is offended, even though you did not mean to offend, you should be more sensitive to that person’s feelings….even if you “do not see the problem” 

no it is not. And many black people ARE offended.
And it is not right singing the Zwarte Piet-song”don’t worry my child, i am a good friend, even though i am black as soot, I mean well” song: wees maar gerust mijn kind, ik ben een goede vrind, want al ben ik zwart als roet, meen het toch goed.” Seriously, in the 21st century? How come this is okay, and football supporters are not allowed to sing anything negative about jews when Ajax plays? 

Does the chimney also give Black Pete, the big red lips, the gold earrings, and the curly hair??? 
PLEASE EXPLAIN THE BIG LIPS AND CURLY HAIR TO ME THEN!
Come on seriously, everyone knows Black Pete is a stereotype charicature of a black person. It is highly offensive.

don’t EVER tell black people when or when not to be offended by racism, mmkay? got it? good. you don’t ever have the fucking right to minimize racism.

just what the hell are getting out of trolling this page, constantly minimizing the offensiveness of calling someone “niggabitch” because it happened in the netherlands? DUTCH READERS were the ones who intially complained! if it wasn’t offensive, no one would have complained in the first place! so don’t even try and get over and make it seem as though the dutch aren’t aware this was offensive, and it’s just americans projecting some kind of oversensitivity about these words in regards to racism onto the dutch. the magazine just didn’t CARE about being racist and offensive before, and now they do because of bad publicity.

and trying to drum up sympathy for this racist idiot of an editor? are you serious? she’s STILL trying to cover her ass on her way out by saying “niggabitch” is some slang that black americans use, which it clearly fucking isn’t, and that she just innocently and innocuously copied that “slang” in order to use it in her magazine. and her flippant responses and non apologies afterwards?she brought EVERY SINGLE LAST THING THAT HAS HAPPENED TO HER ON HERSELF.

seriously, GET LOST.